Re: Self-referentials

[cbmvax!uunet!math.ucla.edu!jimc]

> Date:  Mon, 6 May 1991 13:12:32 HST
> To:  lojban-list@snark.thyrsus.com
> From:  Brian Eubanks <eubanks@uhunix.uhcc.Hawaii.Edu>
> Subject:  Self-referentials 
   
> How does Lojban handle self-referential sentences, such as:
>      "This is a sentence in English"
>      "I would be a Lojban sentence, if I was translated"

dei jufra fi la lojban.		
	This is a sentence in Lojban
le se fanvrpra be fi dei cu jufra fi lo'i glibau
	This sentence's translation is a sentence of English language

(Sorry, I don't remember the proper word for subjunctive, but there is
one.)  When you expand either of these sentences to a referent set you
hit an infinite loop re-expanding dei, and Lojban has no magic 
prescription to deal with this problem -- I assume Hofstadter does.

Also, "dei jufra fi lo'i glibau" (this is an English sentence) is false;
I don't see any philosophical problem if a sentence describes itself in
such a way that one phrasing or translation is true whereas what should
be equivalent is false.  Another example: "This English sentence has a
subordinate clause" vs. "This sentence, which is English, has a 
subordinate clause". 

		-- jimc