Re: whether (was Re: ni, jei, perfectionism)

[Logical Language Group <lojbab@ACCESS.DIGEX.NET>]

>Lojbab to Jorge:
>> I think we often approve of properties.
>>
>> mi zanru leka melbi
>>
>> I approve of beauty.
>
>You need a ce`a for the Lojban meaning to be clear.

You mean ce'u, I assume.   But NO I do not.  To put ce'u in there
(unless I put it in all places) is to focus on a particular place as
significant to my apporval.  The statement is NOT that I approve of
the property of beautiful things or the property of people appreciating
beautiful things or the property of  aspects leading to appreciation of
beauty or the property of aesthetic standards being used for such recognition
of beauty. The statement is appreciation of Beauty, in all of its
ramifications - the relationship between people and beautiful things and
apsects and aesthetic standards.

>> mi zanru le du'u melbi
>>
>> I approve of the fact that (something is) beautiful.
>
>No. "I approve of the proposition that something is beautiful".
>
>"the fact that" is better rendered by "le nu".

I disagree, partly because I do not see any difference between the former
and the latter.  But since ledu'u got its definition in part from djuno,
then le du'u which is something that can be known, must therefore be a
"fact".

>> If I get much from ce'u, then
>>
>> mi zanru leka ce'u melbi
>>
>> I approve of something's beauty
>
>"I approve of the property of being beautiful."

I think I can accept this one.

>> Both of the above seem to me to be elaborations on
>>
>> mi zanru leka melbi
>
>Elaborations in the sense of disambiguations.

Disambiguation is not necessary to those of us who appreciate complexity %^)

lojbab
----
lojbab                                                lojbab@access.digex.net
Bob LeChevalier, President, The Logical Language Group, Inc.
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