Re: properties and locations

[Rick Nylander <rnylander@DTSI.COM>]

>>>        le bitmu cu klama le ka blabi kei le ka xunre
>>>        The wall goes to being white from being red.
>>
>>What are the X4 and X5?  Via what route, and what means of conveyance?
>
>        le bitmu cu klama le ka blabi kei le ka xunre kei
>        le ka blabyxunre kei le nu mi cintypunji
>        The wall goes to being white from being red through being
>        whitish-red by the means of my painting it.

If this were to be adopted as standard lojban, and I say simply:
        Le karce klama
        The car comes.

Would I be saying that the car is changing color, or traveling?
(Please excuse the capitals on my lojban.  My mail editor insists on
automatically putting them there and I'm tired of fighting it :-(

If I say {le ve klama cu xamgu} am I saying that a route to be traveled
is good, or that some particular color transition is good?

Obviously, we can just say that the meaning is derived from context, if
that satisfies everyone.

>Remember that the gi'uste definitions are only guidelines. But I took

That's odd.  I have a vague memory of a rather vicious debate about how
the definition of djuno in the gi'uste should be taken :-)

>>>        mi punji le bitmu le ka blabi
>>>        I put the wall at being white.
>>
>>How about:
>>       Mi punji le ka blabi kei le bitmu
>>       I put the quality white at locus - the wall.
>>
>>I think it's more consistent with the definition.
>
>That's a different paradigm. Properties as transferables (almost
>like possessions).  I'm not saying it doesn't work as well. But my
>example should work too if properties can be used in location slots.

On second thought, I don't think my version says what yours does.  Your
version would (in theory) be that the wall is now white.  My version
could easily be taken to mean that there is now a small spot of white on
the (otherwise colored) wall.

Overall, I can't see a good reason not to accept your proposal, except
for the sake of being cautious.  I "feel" that things may not work as
expected.  But then, I have neither the background nor the analytical
abilities of you, and most others that are active here.

Co'o mi'e rik
(Damn capitals)