Re: Lojban ML: Syllogism and sophism

["Jorge J. Llambías" <jorge@INTERMEDIA.COM.AR>]

Lojbab:
>>> If we want the ambiguitry of English, why bother using Lojban?
>>English is as capable of disambiguation as is Lojban, isn't it?
>
>I don't think so.  Every expression which disambiguates in English is
itself
>ambiguous.

Yes, and every expression which disambiguates in Lojban is
itself ambiguous as well. Could you give a Lojban expression
that cannot be translated to English to the same degree of
unambiguity?

> It is only by using our very sophisticated and human "understanding"
>that we are able to resolve which meaning applies.

Yes. That's true both for English and for Lojban.

>"marji" is "matter" which among other thinsg seems to have composition
>to ever finer levels of analysis.  And "mass" is the degree/amount to which
a
>substance has/is composed of matter, on an open-ended scale.

Ok, so you're using the "xokau" definition of {ni}. We'd have:

        le ni [ce'u] marji = le ka ce'u marji sela'u li xokau
        The extent to which something has a material composition.

The problem with {ni}, as we already discussed, is that it is also
defined to be something else, a number. {le ni marji} is variously
defined to be like {le ka grake} and like {le se grake}.

> As I said,
>this is one of the paradigm-formers that I use to conceive of "ni".  No
>doubt this means you can/will try to tear holes in it %^).

I don't think I can add much to what was said last time we
discussed it.

> But to me
>everything measureable is a "ni" of something.  Usually, though, we find it
>easier toget "ni" from what are in English , adjectives.  e.g. clani ->
long
>ni clani -> length; slabu ->old, ni slabu -> age.

I think this was already discussed as well, but slabu is not old in the
sense of many-yeared, so ni slabu can hardly be age. It would be
the extent to which something is known. For example, my sister has
more {ni slabu} to me than you do, even though you have more age.

My preferred word for age is of course {ka nanca}, or {ka ce'u nanca
li xokau}, "how many years someone has".

co'o mi'e xorxes