self-segregating morphemes

[Ivan A Derzhanski <iad@COGSCI.ED.AC.UK>]

>  Date:     Sun, 23 May 1993 14:59:27 EDT
>  From: Logical Language Group <lojbab@COM.GREBYN>
>
>  Part of the reason for 'all that complexity' is the requirement that ALL
>  gosmu have combining forms, not just some of them,

It is still only some of them that have 3-letter rafsi.

>  and that the gismu/rafsi list have some (if not a lot)
>  expansibility, so that new gismu can be added when new concpets arise.

But it can be reasonably expected that the most fundamental gismu have
been on the list from the very beginning, and surely it is the most
fundamental gismu that warrant 3-letter rafsi.

I agree that the current system is astonishingly complex and constitutes
an unnecessarily great memory load, but I wouldn't go for even a low
degree of ambiguity.  I would still have preferred noFrom @YaleVM.YCC.YALE.EDU:LOJBAN@CUVMB.BITNET  Thu May 27 01:44:25 1993
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Date:         Thu, 27 May 1993 08:44:25 -0700
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From: jimc@MATH.UCLA.EDU
Subject:      Re: how to say
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To: Erik Rauch <erikr@MINERVA.CIS.YALE.EDU>
In-Reply-To:  Your message of "Wed,               26 May 93 11:21:44 EDT." <9305261708.AA24309@julia.math.ucla.edu>

John Cowan proposes to translate "I look through the window" as:
>         mi bancu be le canko ku catlu         (ku added by jimc)
>         I (beyond the window) look

Suppose this sentence were fed to a semantic analysis program; what (if
anything) could the program extract from it?  In particular, what is
the relation between the window and other sentence components?  The
current "definition" of tanru semantics is that the main word is
metaphorically modified in a figurative sort of way.  Thus beyondness
relative to the window is figuratively related to other sentence
components.

I would prefer to see some kind of diktanru semantic rule so that a
tanru like this had some chance at meaning something.  This particular
tanru would be particularly hard for the kinds of rules I've
experimented with.

I would be happier translating the sentence like this, where the main
bridi is said by a subordinate clause to penetrate the window.  In a
predicate language such as Lojban, when predicates are used to express
the relations a semantic analyser can get a grip on the meaning.

        mi catlu fi'o pagre le canko [fe'u]
        I look (which event penetrates the window)

And as was pointed out yesterday (sorry, I forgot who), this form comes
out neater with a real sumti tcita derived from pagre.  I like to think
of prepositional phrases as representing a deep structure where the
tagged sumti is related to the modified bridi in a "fi'o <selbri>" kind
of clause.

        mi catlu pa'o le canko

(I chose pagre rather than bancu because bancu would signify that the
whole event, i.e. spatially the looker, the lookee and the line between
them, was beyond the window relative to some reference point, by default
the speaker's location, ignoring the minor detail that the speaker is
explicitly identified as the looker.)

James F. Carter        Voice 310 825 2897       FAX 310 206 6673
UCLA-Mathnet;  6221 MSA; 405 Hilgard Ave.; Los Angeles, CA, USA  90024-1555
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